Comments on: A Minor Encounter http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/ Jillian C. York is a freelance writer and blogger. Sun, 20 May 2012 03:50:34 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.1 By: ImadK http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3324 ImadK Sun, 14 Feb 2010 02:21:25 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3324 Priapus Wrote: "After all Israel wants to be a Jewish state not a secular one!" Well, I would disagree with that. As I understand it, most Israelis are secular/irreligious and as Jiliam wrote, don't want a theocratic state. But remember, being Jewish seems to mean more in an ethnic/national sense than a relgious one. That's why Jeff Halper said that Israel is really a ethnocratic state. Certainly, i see the one state solution as being more ideal, but it's not without flaws. Jeff Halper said that binational states don't really have happy endings; at best you would get Belgium which is facing a dilemma as the Dutch and French halves are diverging and we might see a divided belgium soon; and what we'll most likely get for a one state Israel/Palestine is something close to Bosnia, which isn't that ideal itself. There's going to have to be a lot of work done to make the foundation of a binational Israel/Palestine, which i think isn't there at this time. One step is breaking down prejudices and discrimination, and another is economic viability for both peoples. Admittedly i haven't thought this out fully through, but the two points i made certainly makes sense, right? Priapus Wrote:
“After all Israel wants to be a Jewish state not a secular one!”

Well, I would disagree with that. As I understand it, most Israelis are secular/irreligious and as Jiliam wrote, don’t want a theocratic state. But remember, being Jewish seems to mean more in an ethnic/national sense than a relgious one. That’s why Jeff Halper said that Israel is really a ethnocratic state.

Certainly, i see the one state solution as being more ideal, but it’s not without flaws. Jeff Halper said that binational states don’t really have happy endings; at best you would get Belgium which is facing a dilemma as the Dutch and French halves are diverging and we might see a divided belgium soon; and what we’ll most likely get for a one state Israel/Palestine is something close to Bosnia, which isn’t that ideal itself.

There’s going to have to be a lot of work done to make the foundation of a binational Israel/Palestine, which i think isn’t there at this time. One step is breaking down prejudices and discrimination, and another is economic viability for both peoples. Admittedly i haven’t thought this out fully through, but the two points i made certainly makes sense, right?

]]> By: Priapus http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3305 Priapus Mon, 08 Feb 2010 21:29:09 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3305 a two-states solution is a nightmare happening only in the imaginations of the people who advocate it, but still obstacles to the one-state solution should be addressed, like demographics, resources, and stability. a two-states solution is a nightmare happening only in the imaginations of the people who advocate it, but still obstacles to the one-state solution should be addressed, like demographics, resources, and stability.

]]> By: Jillian http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3304 Jillian Mon, 08 Feb 2010 19:36:59 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3304 And how would the settlements be solved in a two-state solution? For every objection to a bi-national state, there's a possible solution. Not every Israeli wants a theocratic state. And how would the settlements be solved in a two-state solution? For every objection to a bi-national state, there’s a possible solution. Not every Israeli wants a theocratic state.

]]> By: Priapus http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3303 Priapus Mon, 08 Feb 2010 18:36:32 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3303 But how would demographics complex of Israel be addressed in the one state solution? After all Israel wants to be a Jewish state not a secular one! But how would demographics complex of Israel be addressed in the one state solution? After all Israel wants to be a Jewish state not a secular one!

]]> By: Jillian http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3302 Jillian Mon, 08 Feb 2010 15:28:24 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3302 "I think Israel are inadvertently making a one sate solution the only viable solution." Precisely, Houwari - a two-state solution is no longer viable unless thousands of Israeli settlers are willing to give up their homes. Which a) is unlikely to ever happen and b) is also unjust to their children who have known no other life. A bi-national equal state is the more viable solution for all. “I think Israel are inadvertently making a one sate solution the only viable solution.”

Precisely, Houwari – a two-state solution is no longer viable unless thousands of Israeli settlers are willing to give up their homes. Which a) is unlikely to ever happen and b) is also unjust to their children who have known no other life. A bi-national equal state is the more viable solution for all.

]]> By: Houwari http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3298 Houwari Sun, 07 Feb 2010 22:44:31 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3298 Incidentally I asked this exact question to Avi Shlaim and other panelists a week ago at the progressive London conference. They were unanimous in considering the one state solution the ideal one, but Avi commented that it may not be practical given Israel's attitude. I just don't think two states are feasible. Notice the rhetoric that is used when politicians talk about it, you will hear something like "a two state solution with a secure Israel and an economically viable palestinian state" as Gordon Brown said a few days ago. As in, the goal is not a full palestinian state, but only a state just about limping to be economically viable. In the end, given the current archipelago like territory that is the West Bank and the Israeli settlements, I think Israel are inadvertently making a one sate solution the only viable solution. The injustice of a solution with a Palestinian state that can't bring refugees back, can't have its own arms and doesn't even have a continuity of land is too great for any people to endure. Incidentally I asked this exact question to Avi Shlaim and other panelists a week ago at the progressive London conference. They were unanimous in considering the one state solution the ideal one, but Avi commented that it may not be practical given Israel’s attitude.

I just don’t think two states are feasible. Notice the rhetoric that is used when politicians talk about it, you will hear something like “a two state solution with a secure Israel and an economically viable palestinian state” as Gordon Brown said a few days ago. As in, the goal is not a full palestinian state, but only a state just about limping to be economically viable.

In the end, given the current archipelago like territory that is the West Bank and the Israeli settlements, I think Israel are inadvertently making a one sate solution the only viable solution. The injustice of a solution with a Palestinian state that can’t bring refugees back, can’t have its own arms and doesn’t even have a continuity of land is too great for any people to endure.

]]> By: Priapus http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3295 Priapus Sun, 07 Feb 2010 09:39:10 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3295 a correction: also one state can NOT be the answer Israelis want or Palestinians desire. a correction:
also one state can NOT be the answer Israelis want or Palestinians desire.

]]> By: Priapus http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/05/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3294 Priapus Sun, 07 Feb 2010 09:37:16 +0000 http://jilliancyork.com/2010/02/04/a-minor-encounter/#comment-3294 I never believed in the two states solution, not enough land to do that, but also one state can be the answer Israelis want or Palestinians desire. the solution can not be provided by Israelis and Jews alone, neighboring countries should be involved. I like to read about this issue and your mention of that book is greatly appreciated hope I can find it in local bookshops. I never believed in the two states solution, not enough land to do that, but also one state can be the answer Israelis want or Palestinians desire. the solution can not be provided by Israelis and Jews alone, neighboring countries should be involved. I like to read about this issue and your mention of that book is greatly appreciated hope I can find it in local bookshops.

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